| Issue 12035: | Close tab button on the wrong side | |
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Chrome Version : Version 2.0.181 (181.0) OS version : 10.5.7 Standard behavior for Mac applications is that the close buttons are always on the left side. This is even true for the main Chromium window. But when it comes to the tabs, they are placed on the right (wrong) side. This should be changed. What steps will reproduce the problem? 1. Close the tab by going to the left corner of the tab using muscle memory 2. Click it What is the expected result? The tab closes What happens instead? Nothing, you pause and notice that the close button somehow is on the right corner. Who would have thought that?
Jun 17, 2009
(No comment was entered for this change.)
Status:
Assigned
Jul 20, 2009
We have decided to keep the close boxes on the right to avoid having them compete with favicons.
Status:
WontFix
Jul 23, 2009
So have the favicon change into a close button on mouseover.
Oct 17, 2009
Why not flip it so that the favicon is on the right and the close button is on the left. That seems more natural to me. In Firefox I can install a theme which moves the close button to the correct side, but I do not think chromium themes have this much power.
Oct 17, 2009
Opera does this, and while it feels right, it looks weird.
Nov 5, 2009
Why not make it a preference option?
Nov 5, 2009
I think making it a preference would be a cop out on our UI design. In Firefox you can change the side of the close button within the theme (e.g. http://www.takebacktheweb.org/) which seems like a good compromise to me, but I don't think Chromium themes are going to be this powerful. Has anyone considered eliminating the favicon from the tabs and replacing it with the close button? I doubt I will get much support for that, though.
Dec 11, 2009
John Gruber—Macintosh software tastemaker—has already mentioned this bug twice since the beta launch of Chrome for Mac. http://daringfireball.net/linked/2009/12/08/chrome-for-mac http://daringfireball.net/linked/2009/12/10/safwat-chrome-tabs
Dec 17, 2009
Voting no. Expert users use shortcuts (Command+W). They would be the ones with "muscle memory". Novice users would look for the close button and click it. This would mess up the visual design. Having the favicon change into a close button on hover is a programmer's solution. UI elements should not change behavior when hovered over.
Dec 17, 2009
Comparing FF to Safari as as far as Chome/ Chromium is concerned about interface elements is near pointless. Many Interface elements in FF are caried over from the PC version - plain and simple. For example - <Command Key> + Clicking a Link in a web page in Safari opens a New Window. There is an option for force this too Open a New Tab by default. However - FF does not have the option to change from the default of opening a new Tab to that of opening a new Window. this is done by Shift+ Clicking a link in FF. There is no hack or option or modification to change this. + Click on a Mac is the equivilant of CTRL+ Click in Windows. Something un-Mac like does not make it a bug. Just ask Adobe Inc since their release of CS4. Just the same - there are many PC-based traits in Chrome/ Chromium for Mac that most likely will not go away anytime soon. And unfortunately we're probably stuck with most of them. Or maybe I should see if there is or open upa Bug Report about the + Click function too?
Dec 17, 2009
@johan re: the hover behavior Safari itself does the hover trick, as well as Adium. And it's behavioral memory if not muscle memory.
Dec 17, 2009
"Something un-Mac like does not make it a bug. Just ask Adobe Inc since their release of CS4." Because Adobe is a paragon of well designed Mac applications? The argument that Adobe/Firefox do un-Mac like things is pretty weak. The close button in OS X goes on the left, and any well regarded Mac application follows the system standard on this.
Dec 17, 2009
Why is it necessary that tabs display their page's favicon?
Dec 17, 2009
I have to disagree regarding johan’s comment about muscle memory. 1. It’s not so much muscle memory as it is a system-wide idiom, user habit, and expectation: Close goes on the left, every single time. To paraphrase Nielsen, most users spend most of their time in other apps; and it they will expect your app to follow suit. 2. Neither muscle memory nor expectation of system-wide idiom to apply system-wide as a trait that belongs solely to “power users.” The expectation that underlined text on the Web is clickable, or that a “log in” option is probably at the top of a page, are likewise understood by even novice Web users. It’s the same thing: humans are great at discovering patterns, and expecting them to continue, subconsciously. 3. As someone who ⌘-W’s windows and tabs all the time, I still also use the mouse to close tabs a fair amount of time, as well, and I am thrown off by the placement of close buttons on the left. Note: Glims for Safari is a plug-in that (among other things) adds favicons to Safari. It shows the close button where the favicon was, on hover. This is an acceptable solution in my estimation. I can see the dilemma here, and it is of course desirable to have the close button visible always, if for no other reason than to make the functionality obvious to users. (If the close button becomes visible not just on *favicon* hover but on hovering *anywhere on the tab*, this would probably suffice to make the close button’s behavior discoverable enough.) Glims: http://www.machangout.com/ Lastly, Mac users are greatly annoyed with Adobe for following fewer conventions than they should on OS X.
Dec 17, 2009
edit: 3. “thrown off by the placement of close buttons on the RIGHT.”
Dec 17, 2009
The close box goes on the left on the Mac. Do it right or don't do it at all. Jesus.
Dec 17, 2009
The owner of this bug, alcor a.k.a. Nicholas Jitkoff, is well aware of Mac UI sensibilities. For example: http://docs.blacktree.com/quicksilver/what_is_quicksilver Find something else to complain about... -ch
Dec 17, 2009
Just put the favicon at the close-spot - on the left - and make it into a close button on hover over. It's very simple. Close buttons are on the left on a Mac.
Dec 17, 2009
Arguing over whether the button should be on the left or the right is not useful; that's not the whole problem here. There are two competing issues: - It is a convention that favicons appear on the left. - On the Mac platform, it is a convention that close buttons appear on the left. Breaking either of the conventions makes the tabs look and feel weird. Transforming the favicon into a close button on hover is the best way I can think of to satisfy both. The problem with doing it this way is that without a visible close button, users might not realize how to close a tab. I think this is acceptable, though, given that Safari also hides its tab close buttons.
Dec 17, 2009
To cite Jakob Nielsen's 10 Usability Heuristics... Consistency and standards - Users should not have to wonder whether different words, situations, or actions mean the same thing. *Follow platform conventions*. The platform convention on Mac OS X is to have the close buttons on the left side of the window or tab. Let's not just randomly ignore it. Recognition rather than recall Minimize the user's memory load by making objects, actions, and options visible. The user should not have to remember information from one part of the dialogue to another. Instructions for use of the system should be visible or easily retrievable whenever appropriate. Having the close button invisible until the tab is moused over is not a good solution, even if that makes it easy to squeeze both a favicon and a close button into the same small space. And since the favicon provides largely redundant information (the contents of the tab) and since the close tab action is one of the most common actions, the close button should take precedence. "Because Apple does it" is not a good reason to use bad behavior. Flexibility and efficiency of use Accelerators -- unseen by the novice user -- may often speed up the interaction for the expert user *such that the system can cater to both inexperienced and experienced users*. Allow users to tailor frequent actions. The fact that Command+W closes a tab is not a good reason to forego a close tab button.
Dec 17, 2009
Sorry, the link referenced by the above comment: http://www.useit.com/papers/heuristic/heuristic_list.html
Dec 17, 2009
"The close box goes on the left on the Mac. Do it right or don't do it at all. Jesus." That is simply wrong. For the single case of Apple's pseudo-standard tabs the close buttons do go on the left, but it's erroneous to claim that all close boxes go on the left. Take three Apple-provided examples: Pages, iChat and Automator. All have UI elements that place the close button on the right. True, these aren't 100% analogous to tabs, although the only real difference between iChat and Chrome is that the tabs are vertical versus horizontal. The point is that Apple has shown to us, by example, that the placement of the close box should be based on what the best design is on a case-by-case basis. And for the record, I think that it's silly to claim that the UI should be identical on all of the platforms, but in this case there simply isn't "one Apple way" of doing things.
Dec 17, 2009
@alanhogan has nailed the issue, I completely agree with his assessment. This isn't Chromium-as-the-OS, this is Chrome the browser: a guest on my Mac. Only well-behaved guests tend to get invited back.
Dec 17, 2009
It should really stay on the right, even on Mac — the usability gains from the way tabs move in Chrome/ium to allow rapid closing of a series of tabs would be difficult to replicate with the close button on the left. Tabs would have to collapse rightward as they closed if you were clicking on the rightmost tab, which is extremely odd in a left- to-right language. (See http://www.theinvisibl.com/news/2009/12/08/a-piece-with- a-lot-of-screenshots-about-the-close-tab-behaviour-in-google-chrome/).
Dec 17, 2009
Left side close buttons shouldn't even be up for discussion. Instead, up for discussion should be how much you need to remove to make it happen. Favicons? Toss them. Tab shrinking? Toss it. Anything else that interferes? Remove it. None of these are as important as left side close buttons.
Dec 17, 2009
Nonentity, you make a very good point in that favicon on the left is a convention; but the (biggest) difference between the favicon position convention and the close button convention is the favicon doesn’t affect user *behavior* much. Still, it makes it easier to visually distinguish tabs / infer their contents quickly. s.c.siciliano, thanks for the counter-examples. Though with Pages, at least, the X functions as “reject,” not just “close,” if memory serves.
Dec 17, 2009
As a mac user of almost 20yrs and a Firefox (where the close button is on the right) user of several yrs Iam quite happy for Chromium to also have the close button on the right. Look at it as a test in mental agility :)
Dec 17, 2009
I agree with @futuraprime (and thanks to @s.c.siciliano for those UI examples). Chromium tabs are best in class, as far as I'm concerned, and I really don't think they should be changed. I sincerely doubt that many users are going to be scared off using Chrome by this behaviour. @cquackenbush: As popular as Gruber may be, he's still just one user (albeit one with a very loud voice). His vociferousness shouldn't be cited as a reason to make a chance to Chrome's tabs. What he's stating is his *opinion*—just the same as I'm stating my opinion when I say "Gruber is wrong".
Dec 17, 2009
Not a bug. Chrome's UI is very well thought out. It's quite obvious how to close a tab! Only the self-appointed Mac design Gestapo has a problem with this. You've done a beautiful job on Chrome. Don't cave in to the vocal minority. Keep it as is.
Dec 17, 2009
Why does the close "x" need to be visible at all times? Is there any logical reasoning for this choice? Points against: 1. As currently implemented, the close tab control looks like the letter "x", not a close control. 2. An always-visible close tab control diminishes the space available for the name of the tab. 3. To make way for the favicon, the close tab control is forced to appear on the wrong side of the object it controls. Who thinks some users need the close control to always be visible?
Dec 17, 2009
I agree that Chrome tabs are currently best in class. Favicons definitely aid in recognition. Even as a 20 year Mac user, I feel that the close button on the right feels more proper. Close buttons on the left is not even remotely standard on the Mac.
Dec 17, 2009
Just make the favicon the X close button. Close button should be on the left. Glims does this with Safari when it adds the favicon to the tabs. Then do the same with the Windows version and say thank you.
Dec 17, 2009
Surely if Chrome wished to be consistent with its own behaviour, it should keep the close button of the tab on the same side as the close button of the window. The close button for tabs is on the right in OSes where the close button for the windows is on the right. (Windows/Linux) so why should it not be the case that the close button is on the left for OSX. Otherwise what is next? Chrome will move the close button of the window to the right in OSX to be consistent across all platforms? With that mindset, you are sailing close to being just like a cross platform java app. On a side note, it is clearly obvious that Apple uses close buttons on the right in UI items that are not window like in nature.
Dec 17, 2009
Some ugly ports live out of necessity (Adobe products), others for other reasons (Firefox), but one thing is guaranteed: the majority of users will use apps that they feel comfortable with. If an apps look and feel is inconsistent with everything else on the platform, then you better have a really big advantage over your competition or you won't get traction. Don't see any big advantage with Chrome yet.
Dec 17, 2009
When you're in a foreign country, it is expected that you respect and follow local culture. If the favicon is an issue, drop it, or make it a preference - if turned on, it can appear to the right of the close button, with the close button being the leftmost item in the tab. There's plenty of horizontal real estate in the tab. This solves the "hover" issue, and makes it follow the native conventions of the Mac.
Dec 17, 2009
As someone who uses Chrome in both PC & Mac environments daily for general browsing and user testing, having them in the same place is nice. Don't change it (and according to status as "WontFix", looks like it will stay the same). Plus, most people who even care about things like this use + W to close windows/tabs anyways. I wouldn't have even noticed or cared, because I'm not nit-picking a close tab button. I'm too busy using my browser. I appreciate a good UI experience, and I think most people won't notice, or care (take that as a good or bad thing, however it will fit your argument), as long as it performs its function, and last time I checked, it still closed the tab.
Dec 17, 2009
(No comment was entered for this change.)
Cc:
-j...@chromium.org
Dec 17, 2009
Keep the close button on the right-hand side! I switch between Windows and Mac and I prefer that they are consistent. Also, it really annoys me that Safari has the close button on the left. Perhaps Apple should look at changing it to be in line with Chrome. Chrome currently has the best implementation of tabs out of all browsers on all platforms, don't change it.
Dec 17, 2009
@stuart.maxwell: The implementation in Safari is considered standard to the Mac UI, and is preferred by real Mac users. If you don't like it, there are other platforms such as Windows and Linux, which might better suit your tastes.
Dec 17, 2009
Chrome is open source... if there are so many people annoyed about this, why not just create a fork with close buttons on the left?
Dec 17, 2009
This was one of the first things I noticed when I tried Chome, it just feels wrong. An excellent idea presented earlier was to "have the favicon change into a close button on mouseover".
Dec 17, 2009
There's no reason to keep the close button on the right just for the sake of cross- platform consistency. The interfaces of Windows and OS X are not consistent. They behave differently, they have different human interface guidelines. Deal with it. A few examples of not-so-great UI design by Apple where they themselves have broken this rule is not a good reason to follow suit. Furthermore, I don't understand why closing a series of tabs would be any harder with the close button on the left rather than the right. Since the close button is in the same place on each tab, if you don't move the cursor it should be in position to click the close button on the next tab when it slides into place, whether the close button is on the left or the right. To quote Nielsen again, "follow platform conventions." Not only does putting the tab close buttons on the right go against OS X interface conventions, but it's inconsistent within Chrome as well, which places close buttons on the lefthand side of the window. You don't want the thought process of your users to be "Okay, on my Mac I close things on the left, except in Chrome where I close my tabs on the right. Unless I want to close the window entirely, which I close on the left." They will eventually learn this (as they will eventually learn any bad interface) but they shouldn't have to. Why should the close button be visible at all times? So the user doesn't have to play hide-and-seek when they want to close a tab.
Dec 17, 2009
I don't understand why the close button and favicon can't both be on the left. I don't think this makes them 'compete.' Camino puts both the tab close button and the tab favicon on the left, and it looks good to me. And it's consistent with the rest of the Camino windows and the rest of my apps/OS. The close button on mouseover sounds like a bad idea -- I dislike UI elements that appear and disappear (the few times I launch Safari, this really annoys me -- making me appreciate Camino even more!).
Dec 17, 2009
"The point is that Apple has shown to us, by example, that the placement of the close box should be based on what the best design is on a case-by-case basis." No they haven't. What Apple has shown us is that they basically don't give a crap anymore about consistency or usability. Apple being lame doesn't mean it's okay for Google to be lame. That sounds like Adobe talking. Consistency is king in a GUI. The close button should always be on the left on a Mac. Always.
Dec 17, 2009
As a daily user of Macs as long as they've existed I would have never noticed this 'issue'. I use Firefox and Safari every day and this difference never occurred to me. Adobe, yes -- that's a mess and I hate it. But the close button on a tab? Please.
Dec 17, 2009
I began a public wave entitled “Google Chrome on Mac: Tab Button Placement” containing a “Plus/Minus/Interesting” list for Chrome keeping its Mac tab close button on the right. I believe this is a link to the wave: https://wave.google.com/wave/?pli=1#restored:wave:googlewave.com!w%252BbyJEMuNPE.3 Or, you may need to search “with:public” and the title of the wave. Also, it may be possible to tweak the algorithm so that when the close-tab button is on the left and tabs are being closed from the right, the next tab’s close button could be right underneath the old one’s; for example, grow all the tabs to the left “a lot” and freeze the size of the rightmost remaining tab, sliding it over so that the X is under the mouse cursor. Perhaps this is the “best of both worlds”?
Dec 17, 2009
The close button should absolutely be on the left. The pictures above provide a compelling argument against this, but I argue they are not valid. Both the Pages and Automator x-buttons mean "delete," not "close." The iChat button does indeed mean "close," but it's a tab *in a vertical list.* Chrome's tabs are horizontally- arranged, and resemble a window's title bar, therefore they should have the close button on the left. Indeed, they should not appear from underneath a favicon… that makes no sense. Nor would it look attractive to place the close button on the left or right of a favicon. The solution, then, is to place the *favicon on the right of the tab;* that preserves all the established traditions, customs, and intuitiveness of Mac OS, while introducing no disadvantage (why not have a favicon on the right?). According to Apple's own human interface guidelines, "…an application that merely meets the minimum requirements may be acceptable, but probably does not deliver the features most users expect and is unlikely to inspire admiration and loyalty in its users" (http://bit.ly/4BZj2j). Additionally, "You will have to work extremely hard to make sure that any newly introduced elements fit in with those provided by Cocoa and Carbon" (http://bit.ly/60OP3Z). What does this mean? While Apple never explicitly states where close buttons should be placed on browser tabs, it does state that they should fit in. Close buttons in titlebars have been on the left on Mac since 1984, and I can't think of any better definition of "fitting in" than that.
Dec 17, 2009
Close buttons have been on the left since the beginning of the Mac, and it should stay that way, in my opinion.
Dec 18, 2009
When I first saw the various discussions about the location of the close button, my first thought was 'you people are all insane. Who cares where the bloody button is?' then I made a mental note to check, just how often I try to click in the wrong spot in chrome. The answer, much to my surprise, is nearly every goddamn time. 20, 30, sometimes more than 50 times EACH DAY, I click on the wrong side of the tab, and have to adjust and click back on the other side. As much as I love Chrome as my day to day browser, the sheer amount of time I'm wasting having to THINK about closing each and every tab, is justification enough for me to consider Chrome broken, and until this is fixed, I'll be forced to stick with Safari, much to my dismay.
Dec 18, 2009
Mac Opera has favicons on the right side of tabs, and to me it _does_ feel right. It might look weird to someone who've just switched from Windows version, but for regular Mac Opera users there's really nothing wrong with this. And close button is where it should be.
Dec 18, 2009
The real solution to the conflict with favicons is simple, although I doubt it will be popular: get rid of favicons in tabs. They’re annoying visual clutter. The tab bar should not be trying to attract the user’s attention for the benefit of non-active tabs; there should never be more than one favicon in a window.
Dec 18, 2009
I know that +1 type comments are counter-productive, but what else can you do when the status of a bug is "WontFix"? In my opinion, in the mac version the close button should go on the left (and favicons should probably be dropped from tabs - no one ever missed them in Safari).
Dec 19, 2009
On the left, please. As has been mentioned before, in the Mac UI, 'x' buttons on the left mean close, but they mean delete when they're on the right. This means that a click on the 'x' button of a Chrome tab where it is now would mean 'Delete this webpage from the Internet' !
Dec 19, 2009
#29 and #43 bring about an interesting compromise, which is already used by Adium for its tabs. (For the record, I don't particularly mind the current configuration. I understand the compromise that was made, and believe it was worthwhile.)
Dec 20, 2009
If I wanted consistency with the Windows or Linux versions, I'd be using Windows or Linux. Google fails again.
Dec 20, 2009
You know what else in Chrome has close buttons on the wrong side? And positively reeks of Windows?
Dec 20, 2009
@68 (schmod): You do bring an interesting example. But, as has already been established, a rollover close button is less than user-friendly; it would be far better to have the close button always-visible, so you can see where you're aiming when you first touch your mouse. I think back to my grandma (a loyal Macintosh fan) to whom it would *never* occur to go looking to close a tab on its icon. Then again, if Adium, which could be considered one of the definitive Mac apps, has its tabs display a close button over the icon, then maybe it's not such a big problem.
Dec 22, 2009
A bunch of mac apps work this way already, even Safari does
Dec 23, 2009
You know what's awesome? The fact that there have been 73 comments on here about how much "Google failed" with this decision, and yet not one attempt to fix the perceived problem yourselves. Seriously: It wouldn't be that hard. Google has made a decision, and personally: I agree with it. If you don't, fork the code, and fix it.
Dec 23, 2009
To the folks suggesting we fork it: this is silly. Why? Because it still doesn't fix the problem in the "official" Google version (which is the only place it matters), and some of us posting here do not have the experience or knowledge to make this change.
Dec 24, 2009
issue 24409 needs to be merged into this issue (https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail id=24409#c4)
Dec 25, 2009
Issue 24409 has been merged into this issue.
Dec 25, 2009
Issue 20747 has been merged into this issue.
Dec 29, 2009
Issue 28908 has been merged into this issue.
Jan 2, 2010
This bug has a status of WontFix, why is this still being discussed?
Jan 2, 2010
Because it needs to be fixed. It's a bug.
Jan 2, 2010
The more people that speak up, the likelier Google is to fix this bug; it *is* a bug, after all.
Jan 4, 2010
I would also just like add a "+1" comment. I really would like to have the close button on the left. Just swap the favicon and x button. One small tick box in the preferences would be fine and keep everyone happy.
Jan 8, 2010
I just don't understand why it's an issue to swap the places of the favicon and close button. I really find it baffling. Just do it.
Jan 12, 2010
Close button on the right is a problem. All the browsers that I currently use on OS X have the close button on the left : Safari, Camino, Opera, even FIrefox. It's a headache to come to Chrome and to find it on the right. Make it a preference if you must.
Jan 16, 2010
It makes a ton of sense to leave the favicon where it is and change it to a close box on hover. It does not make sense to leave it where it is when all other mac apps put it on the left.
Feb 1, 2010
Fix it, please. If competition with favicon is your first consideration, close button always wins with more essentiality.
Feb 8, 2010
Windows has an age old idiom of double clicking on the top-left closes that window/document. The top-left is usually an application icon/favicon. This was brought forward from early Windows days and still exists in Windows 7. Can we not have that at least? I'd also vote for that in the Windows version of Chrome too. Also, the "New Tab" tab should have an empty tab icon to be more consistent.
Feb 8, 2010
@tarobomb (comment 71): As pointed out in comments 61 and 67 it is consistent with other apps to have the "delete shortcut" button on the right side of the website snapshot icons on the new tab page.
Feb 8, 2010
The Chromium X button does not delete the web page, it closes the tab therefore the X button is a close button and should adhere to the system default / guidelines for close buttons. I request that this issue be reopened.
Feb 8, 2010
Issue 34924 has been merged into this issue.
Feb 9, 2010
@chrisq (comment 89): Difference is, in those cases, it just “feels” right to any longtime Mac user. The placement of the X on the tab header feels wrong, and the right-aligned X for the "delete shortcut” button on the website snapshots (as shown in comment 71) feels very, VERY wrong. Someone should open a new ticket for that one.
Feb 11, 2010
I like comment #6. Mouseover the favicon changes to a close-tab button.
Feb 12, 2010
Is there a temporary bandaid solution available to fix this? Perhaps an extension? This is driving me crazy.
Mar 20, 2010
same problem here, but close and new tab button on the left.. Gentoo Linux amd64. chromium 5.0.360.0 (42192), compiled using "emerge www-client/chromium-9999". e every new tab start on the left side, Ctrl+<num> and Ctrl+Tab start from right to left.. the following maybe helps or is another bug. If I try drag a tab out of the bar to create a new window, chromium crashes. """ The program 'chrome' received an X Window System error. This probably reflects a bug in the program. The error was 'BadWindow (invalid Window parameter)'. (Details: serial 17229 error_code 3 request_code 140 minor_code 6) (Note to programmers: normally, X errors are reported asynchronously; that is, you will receive the error a while after causing it. To debug your program, run it with the --sync command line option to change this behavior. You can then get a meaningful backtrace from your debugger if you break on the gdk_x_error() function.) """
Mar 21, 2010
Wow! Yes! Please can we have some of that linux code? The close buttons seriously need to be on the left for the Mac! :D Seriously though it seems like your whole bar is being flowed right to left so maybe has something to do with your right-to-left language settings?
Mar 21, 2010
It's the almost latest chromium code, version 42192, I have no right-to-left
settings.
After rebuild chromium to an earlier version 5.0.356.0, the bar problem disappear.
Then I try to rebuild with latest version 42193, the bar problem didn't comes.
Difference between 42192 and 42193, gtk+ code may not helps under Mac:
diff --git a/chrome/browser/gtk/gtk_util.cc b/chrome/browser/gtk/gtk_util.cc
index 305a411..44dd69c 100644
--- a/chrome/browser/gtk/gtk_util.cc
+++ b/chrome/browser/gtk/gtk_util.cc
@@ -504,7 +504,7 @@ void SetButtonTriggersNavigation(GtkWidget* button) {
}
int MirroredLeftPointForRect(GtkWidget* widget, const gfx::Rect& bounds) {
- if (base::i18n::IsRTL())
+ if (!base::i18n::IsRTL())
return bounds.x();
return widget->allocation.width - bounds.x() - bounds.width();
}
However, crash problem still exists, but should be another bug.
Mar 21, 2010
Is the WONTFIX decision final, or is there some way to appeal this? This truly is ridiculous. As mentioned, *every* other browser conforms to the proper Mac UI. This is just one of a myriad UI issues in Chrome(ium) that stick out like a sore thumb and screams "I'm a crummy Windows port" rather than "I am (or at least try to be) a native Mac app". Guess Google's never cared about the native platform for smaller markets like Mac... just look at the UI horror that is Google Earth. This might sit OK with Linux folk whose own "native" UI is a heterogenous mess of GTK/QT/Fox/whatever apps, but it just plain doesn't cut it on the Mac.
Mar 21, 2010
This is a WONTFIX so I am not sure why the discussion is continuing.
Mar 21, 2010
The WONTFIX does not change the fact that it's on the wrong side. Are there truly no real Mac developers on the team who care?
Mar 21, 2010
The discussion is still continuing because obviously folks want this fixed. It's absurd that it's in the wontfix state since it's such a seemingly simple and cosmetic change. As a coder, I would expect that a developer with an understanding of this code would be able to make this change within a few hours or so. Add in some testing and maybe this change could easily be done within a day. WONTFIX? That's fine. We'll keep using this at least to post our frustrations.
Mar 26, 2010
It’s pretty much in character for Google to ignore this. To them, Chrome _is_ the platform, and the underlying OS is just a convenient means to an end. Why reinforce the conventions of OS X when your ultimate aim is to move people onto Google-branded hardware running Google-branded software? (I think it’s relatively safe to make that particular assumption at this time.) If anything, the currently escalating Apple–Google war makes it less likely that Google will play nice with Apple’s HIG.
Mar 26, 2010
So here's some background. I'm not on the UI team, so my recollection is not authoritative (it also means you don't need to convince me that a left close button is the right thing, as I don't have any influence on this. The UI guys are not against a left close button per se, but they are, "fundamentally opposed to something that looks or feels more awkward than what we have". We haven't found a way to put the close button on the left that is not awkward in some way. The options are (I had screenshots of the versions I have patches for, but I can't find them at the moment): 1.) Swap favicon and close button (patch at http://codereview.chromium.org/509009 ) => Looks like ass. Since icons are always on the left of the title, it's not even more consistent with platform guidelines. 2) Favicon and close button at the same position on the left, and the close button only shows on tab hover => Makes it non-obvious how to close a tab, and makes it easy to unintentionally close a background tab when switching to it. Also, this has "the sub- perception level annoyance that comes from an expected control no longer being visible." (quote UI team). 2.1a) Like 2, but always show the close button the the active tab to make it obvious how to close a tab, do not show the close buttons for tabs that are very small, and let the close buttons have a dead time of 0.6 seconds after their appearance to combat unintentional tab closure. Also, change the tab resizing logic on tab close, so that it's still possible to rapidly close a lot of tabs (some dude wrote a blog post saying this is why the close tab buttons are on the right -- turns out, this is still possible with the button on the left). Patch at http://codereview.chromium.org/661265 . This feels a bit weird (there's a pretty out-dated trunk build at http://amnoid.de/tmp/ChromiumMac.zip if you want to try this – be gentle to my bandwidth :-) ). But this still has "the sub-perception level annoyance that comes from an expected control no longer being visible", so it won't fly anyway. 3) Put close button on the left, drop favicon. No patch for this, sorry. => Doesn't work with lots of tabs. Chrome doesn't have a minimum tab width, so you need to be able to rely on favicons when switching tabs. It also makes it hard to switch to small background tabs (chances are you close them instead). 4a) Put both close button and favicon on the left. Patch at http://codereview.chromium.org/503070 . => Looks weird. Maybe fixable? But probably not. I can't see how. 4b) Put close button on the left, and center favicon + text (like close button, document icon, and window title in normal windows). Patch at http://codereview.chromium.org/509012 . => Looks like ass. As I said above, there's no need to write something and try to convince me that I'm wrong. Your best bet is probably a well-authored blog post with a suggestion that solves all the issues mentioned above. I'm not sure one exists.
Mar 26, 2010
Thank you Thakis for such an extensive review. I disagree with point 1. Swapping close button and favicon is perfectly fine, this is how Opera does it and in comment 95 above (https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=12035#c95) hezhit posted a screenshot which demonstrates Chrome handling it this way. There are no guidelines on where to put an icon, you are right however that most of the time, they are to the left of the title. Basically it's a choice between having the icon to the left of the title or the close button, and I personally think having the close button to the left is utterly more important. Screenshot Opera: http://media.pcadvisor.co.uk/cmsdata/news/3200754/Opera%2010%20screenshot_1.JPG Screenshot Chrome swapped: http://chromium.googlecode.com/issues/attachment?aid=-5203088804222848006&name=Screenshot- Issue+12035+-+chromium+-+Close+tab+button+on+the+wrong+side+- +Project+Hosting+on+Google+Code+-+Chromium.png&inline=1
Mar 26, 2010
I would like to also say thanks to Thakis for the extensive review. It's a nice summary of the suggestions in this issue along with the resulting feedback from the UI team. Basically, it feels like Mac OS X users are being told what we want by the UI team, not the other way around. That's alright, I suppose, and I understand that developers don't like to have their name on something they don't like. As a long-time user of Google services this strikes a chord with me similar to what Motorola did back in the late 90's and gave me pause back then with their products/services... I still recall what song one of their ads used: "You can't always get what you want..." That ad campaign flopped based on the obvious message. Anyways... on to bigger issues.
Mar 30, 2010
It seems to me that the feel should trump the look in this case. Some may feel that favicons on the right looks weird, but the close button on the right feels wrong (as well as looks wrong, to me at least). Something looking weird is not necessarily a deal-breaker, but a common action feeling wrong is, in an app used as often as my web browser. So there are >= 1 people who won't use chrome because of the close button position. Are there any people who wouldn't use chrome if the favicon were moved? Perhaps, but it certainly seems less likely to me (though I am admittedly biased).
Mar 31, 2010
Way more than >=1. 70 people have starred this so at least that many. And those are just the ones that actually care about Chrome. There are doubtless countless more that just took one look at the app and trashed it right away, because heck if Google can't even make a browser with something as basic as the close button being on the correct side, how likely is it that the rest of it actually works?
May 10, 2010
After a few tries, I finally have a Chromium build working with thakis' patch at http://codereview.chromium.org/503070 (see attached screenshot). So this is my ideal close tab location for Chrome Mac. Dunno how/where to upload it though for those who want it (.app file)
May 10, 2010
@drew.ramos Looks great. Thanks for sharing!
May 10, 2010
This, indeed, looks excellent.
May 10, 2010
drew.ramos, this is great. You could use a service like http://www.filesavr.com/ which offers a 7 day free service for a start until someone figures out something better. There are undoubtedly others. I would love to have a copy. Thanks.
May 11, 2010
Thanks for the comments! Here are some download links: http://www.filesavr.com/chromium43024 (build of revision 43024, this is the one I use since it looks like the current Chrome for Mac beta, omnibox-wise) and http://www.filesavr.com/chromium46672 (build of revision 46672, fairly close to the latest dev build).
May 11, 2010
I don't want to clutter the board, but thanks for your efforts drew.ramos. Please keep up the good work.
May 12, 2010
Thanks thakis and drew.ramos. I've been using his build as my main browser since he published it and I seriously don't see anything inelegant about the way it looks or feels. I really think that the inability to rapid-close the right-most tab (and whatever other minor things that Chrome purists whine about) would affect way less people than something hugely prominent like the close button being on the wrong side, which goes directly against the UI language that *every* other real Mac app follows.
May 12, 2010
drew.ramos: http://codereview.chromium.org/661265 has code to make rapid tab closure work with the close button on the left; maybe you want to merge that part of the patch into the patch you're using.
May 19, 2010
I want to contrast this issue with what Google is saying about user experience on their Android platform from the I/O conference: "User experience should be your top priority" "Respect user expectations for navigating your app" "Don't hijack the native experience" "Users have been using their [device] longer than your app." "Changing the native experience can interfere with those uses in ways you can't have considered" "Make your app behave consistently with the system" Can I please ask you take your own advice and apply it here? That would be awesome! I still want to use your software you know...
May 19, 2010
Please read comment 103. There's no obvious good solution.
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May 19, 2010
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Jul 7, 2010
Issue 48281 has been merged into this issue.
Dec 6, 2010
Issue 65649 has been merged into this issue.
Mar 11, 2011
Issue 75745 has been merged into this issue.
Mar 20, 2011
Issue 76817 has been merged into this issue.
Mar 13, 2012
Issue 117932 has been merged into this issue. |
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